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 What's the best race for Hunter?

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What's the best race for PVP HUNTER (horde side)
TAURENT
7%
 7% [ 6 ]
ORC
51%
 51% [ 42 ]
BLOOD ELF
12%
 12% [ 10 ]
TWOL
29%
 29% [ 24 ]
Total Votes : 82
 

pouetp0u 
GolemGolem

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  Sun 4 Apr 2010 - 14:38  #
Hi,

Thinking to roll hunter on TWOW, I think a distance class is a plus with latency issues.
So here I go, since racials changed a lot... I couldn't take any decision, Twoll are nice, BE have silence, Orc looks good, Taurents splash the floor... I'll do only PVP on TWOW (questing/leveling in dongeons and PVP outdoor, BGBGBG, ARENa). For you what are the best racials for PVP?

Orc:

1 Blood Fury - instant - 2 min cooldown Increases attack power by (Level*4)+2 per character level (322 at 80). Lasts 15 sec.


2 Hardiness - passive Duration of Stun effects reduced by an additional 15%.

3 Command - passive
Damage dealt by pets increased by 5%.


4 Axe Specialization - passive Expertise with Axes and Two-Handed Axes increased by 5.

Twol

1 Berserking - instant - 3 min cooldown Increases your attack speed by 10% to 30%. At full health the speed increase is 10% with a greater effect up to 30% if you are badly hurt when you activate Berserking. Lasts 10 sec.

2 Regeneration - passive Health regeneration increased by 10%. 10% of total Health regeneration may continue during combat.


3 Beast Slaying - passive Damage dealt versus Beasts increased by 5%.

4 Bow Specialization - passive Your chance to critically hit with Bows is increased by 1%.


5 Da Voodoo Shuffle - passive Reduces the duration of all movement impairing effects by 15%. Trolls be flippin' out mon!

Taurent

1 War Stomp - instant - 0.5 sec cast - 2 min cooldown Stuns up to 5 enemies within 8 yds for 2 sec.

2 Endurance - passive Base Health increased by 5%

3 Nature Resistance - passive Reduces the chance you will be hit by Nature spells by 2%.

BE:

1 Arcane Affinity - passive Enchanting skill increased by 10.

2 Arcane Torrent - instant - 2 min cooldown Silence all enemies within 8 yards for 2 sec and restores 5 + 1/Level% of your Mana.

3 Magic Resistance - passive
Reduces the chance you will be hit by spells by 2%

Exactly, all race have good assets on hunt... Maybe Orc and Twol looks better, but BE has somthink like a vanish.


Last edited by pouetp0u on Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 4:36; edited 3 times in total
Urubaen 
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  Sun 4 Apr 2010 - 17:42  #
pouetp0u wrote:
Hi,

Thinking to roll hunter on TWOW, I think a distance class is a plus with latency issues.
So here I go, since racials changed a lot... I couldn't take any decision, Twoll are nice, BE have vanish but they looks so gay, Orc looks good, Taurent are too big. I'll do only PVP on TWOW (questing/leveling in dongeons and PVP outdoor, BGBGBG, ARENa). For you what are the best racials for PVP?

Orc:

1 Blood Fury - instant - 2 min cooldown Increases attack power by (Level*4)+2 per character level (322 at 80). Lasts 15 sec.


2 Hardiness - passive Duration of Stun effects reduced by an additional 15%.

3 Command - passive
Damage dealt by pets increased by 5%.


4 Axe Specialization - passive Expertise with Axes and Two-Handed Axes increased by 5.

Twol

1 Berserking - instant - 3 min cooldown Increases your attack speed by 10% to 30%. At full health the speed increase is 10% with a greater effect up to 30% if you are badly hurt when you activate Berserking. Lasts 10 sec.

2 Regeneration - passive Health regeneration increased by 10%. 10% of total Health regeneration may continue during combat.


3 Beast Slaying - passive Damage dealt versus Beasts increased by 5%.

4 Bow Specialization - passive Your chance to critically hit with Bows is increased by 1%.


5 Da Voodoo Shuffle - passive Reduces the duration of all movement impairing effects by 15%. Trolls be flippin' out mon!

Taurent

1 War Stomp - instant - 0.5 sec cast - 2 min cooldown Stuns up to 5 enemies within 8 yds for 2 sec.

2 Endurance - passive Base Health increased by 5%

3 Nature Resistance - passive Reduces the chance you will be hit by Nature spells by 2%.

BE:

1 Shadowmeld - instant - 2 min cooldown Activate to slip into the shadows, reducing the chance for enemies to detect your presence. Lasts until cancelled or upon moving. Any threat is restored versus enemies still in combat upon cancellation of this effect.

2 Quickness - passive Reduces the chance that melee and ranged attackers will hit you by 2%.


3 Nature Resistance - passive Reduces the chance you will be hit by Nature spells by 2%.

Exactly, all race have good assets on hunt... Maybe Orc and Twol looks better, but BE has somthink like a vanish.
Blood Elves cannot shadowmeld, only night elves can. BEs have arcane torrent, a close distance silence

Personally, if you are going to pvp as a hunter, i think it'll be nice to roll either orc (stun resistance) or tauren (warstomp;psaved me loads of times).
pouetp0u 
GolemGolem

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  Sun 4 Apr 2010 - 18:30  #
Yep, I edited, I mess NE and BE racial lol, I found that's strange BE can
shadowmeld now Very Happy

Exactly I'm balancing with Taurent, Orc and Twol for :
Da Voodoo Shuffle - passive Reduces the duration of all movement impairing effects by 15%. Trolls be flippin' out mon!
This racial is new?
deadanus 
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  Sun 4 Apr 2010 - 22:09  #
ORC
bolomas 
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  Mon 5 Apr 2010 - 6:11  #
Hey pouet, I was looking for a good hunter to team my pally with for arena. If you are interested come lv fast Smile

_________________
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Fluberwinter 
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  Mon 5 Apr 2010 - 6:18  #
Troll's good.
I like the bows buff, and the attitude.
That's why I got myself a SM
pouetp0u 
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  Mon 5 Apr 2010 - 8:50  #
I think choose ORC, deadanus persuades me:D

Ya Bolomas, you're welcome Smile I'll be ok for BG team 1st to get a basic PVP gear very quick. Maybe we'll need a few raid to get a good weapon also.

Otherwise, I should be playing now, but my downloading stopped at 93 % in the night and does not resume any more...

Crapy speed downloading 2M... It change from 30M...

aaaaaaaaaaaaa
stItCh 
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  Mon 5 Apr 2010 - 9:59  #
Hi pout

Get the Orc hunter. See you soon online.
Naklin 
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  Tue 6 Apr 2010 - 8:12  #
ORC > Troll.

Troll has haste, orc hase zerk as well.
but orcs +% pet output is what'll make the diff, since you have to have your pet at all times anyways.
Thats a HUGE difference!
Besides being stun resistand always helps, and orcs get axe expertise for free.

The troll racial is on a 3 minute CD with 10 secs duration and the orc has a 2minute CD with 15 secs duration. which one is up longer? Not to mention that the troll one needs you to be LOW hp in order to really kick in. Which, in case of a pve-group will NOT happen).

And since BE and tauren have USELESS stats for hunters (even for pvp... useless), i wonder...... whats the question here?

HORDE HUNTER ? ORC!

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Hirna_zjmj 
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  Tue 6 Apr 2010 - 15:28  #
Even though I stopped playing I sometimes read the forum, and I can't let you say BE has useless skill for hunters.
Any good caster will stick to the hunter in melee, so the silence is defo not a useless skill. It can avoid roots, fear and other CC, and the balance can easily go to your favour.
Tauren, well, a stun, as short as it can be, is always useful too (look at what can be done with a simple shadowfury). Not to skip like you did.

If you want a good hunter go for NE. If you wanna play horde, play an orc for a good balance between PvE and PvP, play troll for PvE and BE for PvP.
that's how I'd do it.
Have fun then.


Edit : I rarely see a hunter using his pet in PvE so just drop the orc thing theory =S
StiXx 
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  Tue 6 Apr 2010 - 17:37  #
Hey

I gotta agree with hirna here, also im playing a be hunter.

The silence thing is a life saver as soon as your up against a mage or just that extra silence to stop someone from healing.

Also in pve im using it for the mana regen. Im the kind of guy that just keeps on shooting and if my mana goes oom before i know it, in this way i can switch to viper, i use the passive at the same time i switch to viper so i have that little bit of mana to make the first shot with a special shot so the regain is quicker instead of needing to auto shot to get the first mana back.

Also concerning pets for pve.. the only thing ill use is a wolf for the ap bonus, as soon as i send it in to fight any raid mob or boss that has aoe attacks ( which almost every mob or boss has ) its bye bye pet unless there is a healer thats focusing on pets.

the bonus you should focus on for pvp are:

Orc: Stun resistance, hardiness
Troll: berserk, bow spec, and voodoo
Tauren: Stomp, extra life
BE: Arc torrent, magic res ( its only little but still ).

for pve i would make an orc, but pvp you should definatly not under estimate the use of stomp or arc torrent its essential for hunters to be able to get away from their target.
Naklin 
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  Tue 6 Apr 2010 - 21:09  #
arc torrent as mana regen is 800 mana on 2minutes. and thats with my priests mana pool. for your hunter its going to be less.
so, yes, sweet, you will have a tiny tad more mana in pve. as compared to a berserking racial that gives off more than the tiny tad of mana during the fight? really? R-E-A-L-L-Y?

Now, PVE wise, keep taurens out of hunter equations.

PVP wise, i give you that arcane torrent silences. ok. fine.
in a melee range.
Now, if you have to run up to the mage or any class that you would silence (usually also ranged), you get soaked while you run up, and basically you don't soak him, for a 2 second silence, which at best, means 2 arrows off you (since you have to take distance or waste a disengage to get further off.
Defensively speaking, I'd say. sure, maybe. again. 2 seconds...
Use your scattershot, silencing shot and feign death (wonderful to interrupt casts) on key moments and you will have a better gain. w-a-y better.
And lets not forget: if a ranged class is trying to go into melee range to you, he gets soaked while he does, and once he is, you disengage anyway...
Line of Sight is even more powerful than Arcane Torrent.

As for your "Pet Theories".
Either build correctly and have full avoidances on pet or have a ranged pet. both works.
we don't heal pets here in pugs, and they dont die, and they do a LOT of the hunter's %.

Not to flame people, but I played hunters for years. And honestly..., your points simply don't outweigh orcs or trolls.

As for somebody stating to roll a NE for an elf... I hope you only meant for PVP. and ONLY because of shadowmeld. because judging by the racials:

Night Elf

* Shadowmeld : Activate to slip into the shadows, reducing the chance for enemies to detect your presence. Lasts until cancelled or upon moving. Any threat is restored versus enemies still in combat upon cancellation of this effect, 2 minute cooldown.

* Quickness : Reduces the chance that melee and ranged attackers will hit you by 2%.

* Wisp Spirit : Transform into a wisp upon death, increasing speed by 75%.

* Elusivesness: Reduces the chance enemies have to detect you while Shadowmelded or Stealthed.

* Nature Resistance : Reduces the chance you will be hit by Nature spells by 2%.

thats the only thing a hunter could benefit from. in pvp. or maybe some very few solo pve situations.


its not because you see a ton of NE hunters that it'll be the best choice.
hunters are a "pure" class. they have one role: Damage dealing (unlike multi classes like paladins, druids, etc).

If you go for pve, that will be what you will be looking out for in racials.
for pvp, see above posts and my comments.

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pouetp0u 
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  Wed 7 Apr 2010 - 8:29  #
thanks, ORC looks like a good race for PVP hunt.
I'll not do PVE at least only to get my lvl80 and good weapon in RAID to have fun in BG and ARENA after.

On PVP view ORC looks very fine. BE silence seems useless since you have to be near your tagret to use it. That's why I didn't think more about BE.
Hirna_zjmj 
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  Wed 7 Apr 2010 - 8:44  #
I was talking about casters coming in melee, for instance to frost nova you then freeze and you're fucked up (trinket + icy veins you're dead). Who would stay ranged, getting interupted by a pet + lolz autoshoot arrows ? He will not be able to cast while you keep pew pewing him...not a good strategy.
I usually use my engineer boots to get to melee (on my lock), then I shadowfury, HoT (pet + hunter feared) then I'm not interrupted anymore. If I stay ranged, I can always shadowfury then fear the hunter, but the pet will still be on me, interrupting me anyways. Plus as you mentionned let's not forget Silencing shot (lol why the hell would hunters be able to silence anyone with an arrow btw).

Okay, that's for the arcane torrent OP bonus.
Now for NE, I meant PvP AND PvE. They have an agility bonus making them the race with the higher agility quantity reachable (And what's the best stat for hunters ? Agi, got it.). Plus in case of a "resisted" FD when pulling a boss, you still have shadowmeld, hmm quite useful then uh ? In PvP as you mentionned, nothing much to say about their OP racial talents.

Now Pouetpou, you only want to PvP, go for a BE/tauren seriously. It's the best you can chose to get extra life savers when all your cds are used (disengage, scatter-shot,...). Orc is quite okay too imo but i'd take it more to PvE.

I'm opened to any criticism and I'll stay tuned to this topic Wink
Urubaen 
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  Wed 7 Apr 2010 - 9:52  #
Well, he said he wanted to be balanced between pvp and pve.. therefore it's going to be orc. Increased pet dmg , PVP/PVE, - stun for pvp. Tauren hunter is nice but useless in pve, unless you could warstomp a boss of course. Otherwise, blood elf would really be the last choice. The silence is nice for pvp but only lasts 2 seconds, the mana gain is nice but you may as well ask me to innervate you (right avanti? Wink)
StiXx 
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  Wed 7 Apr 2010 - 12:33  #
Naklin wrote:
arc torrent as mana regen is 800 mana on 2minutes. and thats with my priests mana pool. for your hunter its going to be less.
so, yes, sweet, you will have a tiny tad more mana in pve. as compared to a berserking racial that gives off more than the tiny tad of mana during the fight? really? R-E-A-L-L-Y?

Now, PVE wise, keep taurens out of hunter equations.

PVP wise, i give you that arcane torrent silences. ok. fine.
in a melee range.
Now, if you have to run up to the mage or any class that you would silence (usually also ranged), you get soaked while you run up, and basically you don't soak him, for a 2 second silence, which at best, means 2 arrows off you (since you have to take distance or waste a disengage to get further off.
Defensively speaking, I'd say. sure, maybe. again. 2 seconds...
Use your scattershot, silencing shot and feign death (wonderful to interrupt casts) on key moments and you will have a better gain. w-a-y better.
And lets not forget: if a ranged class is trying to go into melee range to you, he gets soaked while he does, and once he is, you disengage anyway...
Line of Sight is even more powerful than Arcane Torrent.

As for your "Pet Theories".
Either build correctly and have full avoidances on pet or have a ranged pet. both works.
we don't heal pets here in pugs, and they dont die, and they do a LOT of the hunter's %.

Not to flame people, but I played hunters for years. And honestly..., your points simply don't outweigh orcs or trolls.

As for somebody stating to roll a NE for an elf... I hope you only meant for PVP. and ONLY because of shadowmeld. because judging by the racials:

Night Elf

* Shadowmeld : Activate to slip into the shadows, reducing the chance for enemies to detect your presence. Lasts until cancelled or upon moving. Any threat is restored versus enemies still in combat upon cancellation of this effect, 2 minute cooldown.

* Quickness : Reduces the chance that melee and ranged attackers will hit you by 2%.

* Wisp Spirit : Transform into a wisp upon death, increasing speed by 75%.

* Elusivesness: Reduces the chance enemies have to detect you while Shadowmelded or Stealthed.

* Nature Resistance : Reduces the chance you will be hit by Nature spells by 2%.

thats the only thing a hunter could benefit from. in pvp. or maybe some very few solo pve situations.


its not because you see a ton of NE hunters that it'll be the best choice.
hunters are a "pure" class. they have one role: Damage dealing (unlike multi classes like paladins, druids, etc).

If you go for pve, that will be what you will be looking out for in racials.
for pvp, see above posts and my comments.

Hey Nak,

The arcane torrent wasnt meant for pve use as i said it is kinda usefull for pve but doesnt outweight the orc stuff, as mention before if you pve go orc


The stuff your saying about the pvp part is pure theory and utopia like 1 dissengage will keep you away from the guy during the entire rest of the fight or even for a full 18 sec untill you can dissengage again. any good caster going up against a hunter tries to stay as close as possible to the hunter, your first get away will be scatter shot or dissenage (or detterence) as you mention before but about 3 seconds later he will blink or whatever and be back to you again the second time youll do the other one... what are you gonna do then? all that other stuff is in cd. the arcane torrent or stomp is perfect at that time so after that get away that it helped you to get your other stuff is off cd again so you can make a 3th get away or even a 4th one if necesarry since their also exists things as trinkets.

Also as another note towards the los thing how can you do damage to them if your los? most casters have a lot of instant spells aswell like dots so youll get the shorter end of that. the times that casters have to stand still for 1.5 sec to hit you is long gone.

a simple feign death would only work when a ranged class is away from you, the only other range class that is none noob would do this is another hunter...

also not the flame but just make a good advice, and as mentioned before pve i recommend orc aswell.
Naklin 
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  Wed 7 Apr 2010 - 14:27  #
@ Hirna:
You are open to criticism, you say? thats good, because I do have ... "some".

As always, It is a game, and things always stay open for discussion. But nonetheless, I think that we have to talk about something that has happened, especially since 3.0.
You do not have so many "choices" as in what / how to play. there are 1-2 "right" builds, and deviating from them for more than 3 points will result in a gimped character, usually. this is sad. But this also leads to more conclusive discussions.

In order to make my point, I have to introduce some "constants" into my argumentation, so that later we talk about the same things.

1) When talking about PVP, I don't care if it is 1v1 or XvY, but I DO assume there some sort of LoS (Line of Sight) modifier in the terrain. Anything else is either far from realistic or simply a mexican standoff, and then, screw racials or skill, the guy with the big burst wins.

2) When talking about PVE, we will make a difference between "solo", where you might engage or avoid single or multiple mobs in a tricky and clever way (there, usually, utility-oriented skills are preferred over raw output), and "raid" / "instancing" situations, where you are in a larger group and your role is 99% raw damage and 1% utility (it wasn't always like that, but it has changed into that).

So, talking about your specific encounter as with a Warlock, I have to say that yes, a lock might (MIGHT) try to get into melee range for additional CC as fear, etc. but usually any decent lock who is into PVP nowadays will be affliction specced. Before you say anything, i KNOW you can pvp with other builds, and maybe even well, if you play very very good; but affliction spec for pvp is simply OP. in the case of an affli specced lock, the hunter pet can't interrupt shit since almost everything is either instant or 1.3 second cast. furthermore, thats about the only times when the hunter will hit the lock, as he will stay out of LoS except to refresh dots and let the hunter die miserably, with an occasional fear or CC. Also, a hunter's pet doesn't interrupt (or barely, and if, then its on a CD). They do pushback. and almost every calss gets -70% pushback effect through talents. Which you should have if you pvp. I swear to god, the pushback off pets is ridiculous.
If the lock uses another spec, yes, he will come into melee range, probably. But he doesn't need to, really. enough CCs on distance, esp. with pets. Furthermore, a lock is a pure dps class with healing abilities through talents and stones. I have yet to see a hunter beat a lock. Seriously. Usually thats his antagonist, as every class has 1-2 classes they simply will lose to 95% of the time, depending on luck, proc and player's skill.

In the case of a mage, he'd still be nuts to go into melee to nuke you with all his cooldowns. any decent mage will poly you, then go full cooldowns on you. and thats where he either is in melee range (after he polied you) so you can't silence shot him, but you should be able to scatter and / or feign death, making him lose about 1-6 seconds of his "buffed state", or he is in ranged distance, where you can silence shot (maybe even scatter, if he is dumb enough to be too close, yet too far) and feign death, which buys you also about 1-6 seconds less of burst on you. In any case, a mage running up to you, to nova you and THEN burst you, is win for you anyway you put it. After he opens, his nova will most probably break, and if he doesn't burst you like "immediately" to zero, you won. Poly preparing, bursting from melee, then nova and giving the last notch on multiplicative damage is the way to go. and then, arc torrent isn't the matchmaker.

@ all:
Again, in both matchups, LoS play would be the way to go. your job is to not let the mage get close to you. mages are drained in a swiff, then they evo, then they are redrained, then they are dead. With the occasional exception where you burst the crap out of them. Trust me, Arcane Torrent will help you in a VERY low skill bracket, as far a pvp ratings go.

@Stixx:
Drain option against a mage is insofar viable, as it would be a longer matchup. in all cases I get the feeling you are all going from a make that is in open space in front of you. You CAN screw with the mage. A lot. either you find the right moment to clutch, and yes, that is the moment not to be in LoS and unleash all you got, or, until that moment comes, you should avoid direct confrontation, and kite the crap out of him, while draining, feigning, freeze and freezing trap him, chimera shotting, slowing him as well. He can blink, but not around corners. Your pet will keep dmging him. Usually any pet will mitigate AOE damage, so the way for him to nuke your pet is direct single target spell.
Thats when you either recall it, or leave it be, and at the same time peek out your head again and unleash on him. if he switches targets, you go back into the old "LoS Game", drain mana, keep stings up do an occasional short burst on a silencing CD "maybe". Losing against a mage, even without arcane torrent should be a signal for him heavily outgearing you or you making a mistake.
Additionally, your pet shall either root, silence or snare him, which further enhances the kiting. His occasional blink will be a drop in the water, really.
Kiting around a pillar, ramp or any obstacle large enough to evade nova range will make a mage nuts.
I know blink is 20y and disengage only 13, but if you jump right before disengage you win about 5-6 yards, and that puts it at a same length. disengage is an easy version of a rocket jump in quake. you can do it in a fraction. Plus, it is off the global CD, meaning you can immediately chain anything with it.
Knowing the traps of the hunter, knowing they have an initial root, followed by snare, and a block on distance, I really wonder how you can lose against a mage.
Would you mind giving me an example transcript of your typical fight with a mage, from setup to end, with a LoS modifier involved?
Moving on... post is getting long.


PVE:

AGI is the most important stat for survival hunters. nice. (could you please refer me to where night elves have AGI boost, please? I am not trying to be an ass, its just I really didn't know that. I would be interested where you got it from, and how much it is. thanks).
But for marksman hunters, which dish out way better dps than SV hunters, if well played, its raw AP and not agi. I DO know agi provides AP, but some gear distribute more points into AP than agi, and that will be his preferred piece.

@Hirna:
Feigning death on a pull..... you made me laugh. thats classic wow. Thats before you had The bloody aggro shot that diverts aggro to your tank (or any other target). Thats what you pull with, and nothing else, if at all, actually. Your argument is correct for classic wow.
I simply couldn't hold it. If I am wrong, please lecture me. But atm I can't recall any other situation that would apply. (for raid play).
Solo play, shadowmeld is fun, at best. but defo not group play.

Well, I have more to say, but wait for your replys.
i love this thread.

--NaK

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  Wed 7 Apr 2010 - 14:50  #
Hirna is talking about the hunter starter stats, not racial, in which case the night-elf does have the highest AGI

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/hunter/

the chart says it all! Wink

(lol, tauren and dwarf fail in AGI at start)

P.S. : arcane torrent is pure luck(beside the enemy healer in arena while being nuked, disengage and A.T. silence the healer by chance, etc)! No hunter is actually going to get close to the enemy just to silence-_-", or mage, or warlock. Only class that can use A.T. without getting *squished* right now is paladin Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes not to mention the blood-elf warriors in cataclysm.
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  Wed 7 Apr 2010 - 15:41  #
1. Agreed. And I'm not discussing the fact that LoS is one of the decisive point in a game.

2. By PvE I'm reffering to HL raids only. And I agree, hunters now have a lot of different techniques to pull a boss. Anyways on chinese realms, many of them just use FD in order to pull without adding or things like that, its kind of an exploit.

I'm talking about chinese realms, where destruction and frost are the most common specs for casters. So yes, casters do keep some time to cast, not all of their spells have CD. So pushback (what i was refering to by saying interupt btw) is still part of the game, combined with LoS it's almost impossible for a caster to hit the hunter with a frostbolt for instance.
Guess your example is relevant here as with LoS affliction warlock vs hunter is no-match. What about fire/frost mage ? Destrolock ? Priest ?
And seriously, if a warlock stay in range while in the LoS of the hunter...what do you want to do ? They have instant arrows shot @ 36 yrds while all you can do is trying to cast immolate, he steps backwards every 2 seconds and you just can't hit him (taking into account the fact that despite the pushback reduction, you still lose some time to cast everytime the pet hits you).

Now mage, ahhh mages. Poly, make the hunter use his trinket. Go to melee. Just blink to melee as soon as he used disengage, frost nova then deep freeze, use trinket while icy veins (let me remind you those 2 abilities don't cause any GCD) , you have time to cast 1 frost bolt, and probably a second one if you have enough haste (and nowadays, what mage is not capped with haste ?) before deep freeze ends then Ice Lance as he will probably still be rooted, only with those 3 hits you got the hunter HP pretty low. And that's where the BE racial would be pretty useful. If you just used disengage you can silence him while he's in melee (for 2 seconds ? right then just throw a frost trap and step backwards). You just have to get the reflex, if he deep freezes you, it's over.

But anyways we're not here to talk about how you should play a mage are we ? Smile


After all, as you said it's just like everything else. BE Racial is just OP against casters that actually have casting time. But what would an orc offer more against an affliction lock for example ? It just depends of the opponent, but im talking against the most common specs, at least in TBC.

And NE do have the higher ammount of agility among all the races, damn it Nak' I thought you'd knew that, it's like the base of the gayme Smile

Anyways, I'm gonna eat now,

See you guys later !
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 4:40  #
It seems confuse to choose now, and still have to wait the realm open for 1 or 2 days.

But I agree that's very interesting to see all point of views.

I changed this topic in VOTE mode.

Maybe it will be more clear to choose after all. Just vote for a PVP context Smile

Thanks and good day!
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 4:54  #
gnome
bolomas 
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 4:58  #
I had a friend very good pvper and who mastered hunter. He was an orc. Also in Bronzebeard, when dueling at the doors of ogrimmar, all glads hunters were orcs. The stun length reduction+bloodlust+axe expertise(who said less dodges on wingclip?) all added are simply much better, not mentioning the pet bonus.

Arcane torrent is a very good pvp spell, as a pally I wouldn't trade any of this game racials with it. But yeah in the present case, hunter, arcane torrent will never win you fights like it does for a pally, or a rogue.
Actually hunters don't need this to win against mage or warlock anyway.

Otherwise just a thing guys about the pvp premade strat Smile

1. Pvp isn't balanced around duels and 2v2

2. Mage vs Hunter, equally geared and skilled the hunter win. That's the rock, paper, scissors rule. Warlock "always" have been a free kill for huntard autoshot. Still talking about 1v1 equally geared and skilled.

3. Concerning the class start, I'd say you can pretty much ignore these. Blizzard recently modified them in 3.3
Quote :

Racial Attribute Bonuses: These bonuses have been recalibrated to even out the amount of starting health on the various races. All races start with a standardized level of stamina, except for orcs, dwarves, and tauren who now start with 1 extra point of stamina. For each class, bonuses and penalties to all attributes have been adjusted so that each race has an equal attribute total.

so the table on the official website is still the old one that have been there for years and anyway, +7agi at lv80 will not break the game.

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Last edited by bolomas on Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 5:15; edited 1 time in total
StiXx 
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 5:12  #
@nak...

Again heheh

It seems you are going out from 1vs1 situations.

IF your playing arena as a hunter 2v2 or 3v3 chances are very BIG
You will be targeted first by 2-3 players at the same time atleast ive always been..

You will need more defences then that to be able to stay alive longer.
simple kiting and los until the right moment is not in it when beeing chased by multiple enemy's.

Also for the 1vs1 most mages just try to freeze trap you run around you and use instant cast spells note that the entire time your also frozen so even with frost traps and concussion your speed is still similar to theirs. hunters aint the only class that hve stuff to keep ppl in place.

Im not saying you cant beat mages without that but its a great tool and i tent to use it a lot other casters on the other hand like locks, stomp or silence are life savers
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 5:23  #
StiXx not to stab you in the back ^^', but back in tbc, if you'd arena with at least 300 resilience you'd survived long enough to be healed, get help from your mates to peel of the opponents, and get back in range.
The big problem back in mainland, is that even at low rating you had full glads geared players, dealing a hell of damage. Hunter is one of these classes that need a min of resilience to survive these moments where they get focused until they unstick themselves.
Just not gonna happen in PVE gear trust me.

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Last edited by bolomas on Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 5:40; edited 1 time in total
StiXx 
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 5:26  #
I got full s2 gear and s4 gloves. over 300 res this still happening...
but then again my team dont have a healer but a ret pally Razz

So im depending on these extra defenses thats why im argumenting them now Smile Calling those useless is breaking my heart hehe
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 5:29  #
I blame urubean

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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 5:33  #
bolomas wrote:
I blame urubean

I agree
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 5:34  #
Sign me up for a gnome, too.
:-)


as to prior posts, i thought i felt something odd.
Tbc? Seriously? Wasn't that in something... Like 2008?

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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 5:45  #
Bah im regretting roling a pally i wanne make a huntard Sad
Hirna_zjmj 
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 13:20  #
Don't do as if you were a long time LK player Surprised)

Anyways just roll what you want, I've just been refused from McGill univ. and for what ? Lack of space. Damn it my grades were good but...meehhhh....
So anyways my head is not really into huntards atm, follow nak's opinion, i'll just stop giving advice.
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 13:36  #
Quote :
IF your playing arena as a hunter 2v2 or 3v3 chances are very BIG
You will be targeted first by 2-3 players at the same time atleast ive always been..

must be the lack of a healer in your team. playing as a priest i can only assure you (as a druid as well) that being the healer is the main focus of the damaging class somehow.
If they don't focus me, i have rarely no problem to outheal any damage, except if they CC extremely well. hence, you won't really be targeted in a 2v2 with a healer.

in a 3v3, depends on your setup.

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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 15:29  #
bolomas wrote:
I blame urubean

@stixx too:

A man can fail many times, but he isn't a failure until he begins to blame somebody else.

and also.. back when we 5v5'd stixx, you didn't even have 200 resi -_- of course you die quickly. Or maybe you shouldn't have stood in the fire scratch scratch scratch scratch lol!
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 16:31  #
at the time we 55 i didnt even have pvp gear Razz

But still i blame you Smile

@nak

Well that could be i didnt do arena in wotlk so i have no exp in this all i know in tbc is that the extra silence helped me a lot many times.
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 17:10  #
Naklin wrote:
Quote :
IF your playing arena as a hunter 2v2 or 3v3 chances are very BIG
You will be targeted first by 2-3 players at the same time atleast ive always been..

must be the lack of a healer in your team. playing as a priest i can only assure you (as a druid as well) that being the healer is the main focus of the damaging class somehow.
If they don't focus me, i have rarely no problem to outheal any damage, except if they CC extremely well. hence, you won't really be targeted in a 2v2 with a healer.

in a 3v3, depends on your setup.
o control heal and focus DPS it depends on how you play also :p
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  Thu 8 Apr 2010 - 20:42  #
ever met 5 priests in arena?
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  Fri 9 Apr 2010 - 3:15  #
bazza wrote:
ever met 5 priests in arena?

mm never... When I used to do Arena with a friend, we only did 2v2
Him has Muti rogue and me as Disc Priest.
Most of time I was focused and we win (benyhill). hate ice chainslolgrip and co.
Most of time if they control me and kill him we lose...
As Disc Priest my job was to... Heal my mate of c, and the most important: Mana bun, control the other healer. And also DPS my mate focus.
Against DUIDWAR it was... very hard or impossible to win.
Against DKPAL was the bracket the most impotant at that time, we got our chance.
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  Fri 9 Apr 2010 - 10:42  #
Orc without a doubt.

Considering pvp, if you ever played a hunter with more than 2200 arena ratio, you know without a doubt that the thing you fear the most are stuns.

Considering pve, the increase AP is not bad, troll used to be the best because of the +5% damage on beast (which is now 3% if i don't mistake) but the racial is quite useless on wotlk. So with the +5% dmg of the pet, orc remains the best choice.

But the best thing to notice is to choose what you would prefer, regarding skins cause your char is what you will see most of the time.
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  Fri 9 Apr 2010 - 11:53  #
i know its off-topic, but @pouet:

I played a lot with a DK and me as disc priest recently, as well as with some other dps classes. ESPECIALLY if you played with another rogue who can apply the -50% healing poison.....

Druid matchups were hard for me, as you cannot mana burn them the "active" way. they are too mobile, cast 2-3 hot and disappear and have insane regen.
But I swear to god, if you chain dispell his HOTs on his dps. i mean, spam the fucking button while your dps is bursting, the druid is oom faster than lightning..... always works. Smile

plus he has to come out to heal and can be CCed even.

Smile

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  Fri 9 Apr 2010 - 12:19  #
Naklin wrote:
i know its off-topic, but @pouet:

I played a lot with a DK and me as disc priest recently, as well as with some other dps classes. ESPECIALLY if you played with another rogue who can apply the -50% healing poison.....

Druid matchups were hard for me, as you cannot mana burn them the "active" way. they are too mobile, cast 2-3 hot and disappear and have insane regen.
But I swear to god, if you chain dispell his HOTs on his dps. i mean, spam the fucking button while your dps is bursting, the druid is oom faster than lightning..... always works. Smile

plus he has to come out to heal and can be CCed even.

Smile

/off topic too, waiting for more votes on Orc (7 till now Very Happy )
@Nak: Dispell and Manaburn are soooo vicious Very Happy I love it.
But Dispell hot, erm, not sure my manapool was big enougth at that time Very Happy Can dispell its inervate after manburn the druid, forgot if we can or not... I came to wow eu to see my priest on armory to see how much Rési I got, but it seems I didn't log it for too long time... :'(((
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  Fri 9 Apr 2010 - 13:14  #
/offtopic

Yes, innervate can be dispelled. Like Naklin said, dispelling Hots will just kill the druid+mana burn= bye bye . Only way to make a druid lose is to make him refresh hot all the time or jump him right at the beginning and waste all cds (If you fail to kill him, you'll end up being killed by him and his war friend--)
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  Sat 10 Apr 2010 - 8:40  #
just dispell HOTs. no need to take risk.
It's actually almost as fast or better than mana burning, since you dispel TWO HOT's at a time. muahaha. it justs makes him dry as hell. afterwards, he'll run, trying to drink. DOT him, if your DPS has no pet or is busy with his DPS, and refresh dot or try to make him scared a litle, just so that he "barely drinks". even if he gets enough mana for 1-3 new HOTs, dispell, ding. it's too mean.

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  Sat 10 Apr 2010 - 8:49  #
As if dispelling didn't cost any mana.
As if the other DPS was not dpsing your dps so you don't have to keep healing him.
As if your shadowfiend was not going to be controled by the other dps/the druid so your mana regen was faster than the druid's.


Nope nope nope, against druids life is not that easy guys.
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  Sat 10 Apr 2010 - 11:38  #
Hirna_zjmj wrote:
As if dispelling didn't cost any mana.
As if the other DPS was not dpsing your dps so you don't have to keep healing him.
As if your shadowfiend was not going to be controled by the other dps/the druid so your mana regen was faster than the druid's.


Nope nope nope, against druids life is not that easy guys.

I agree.
In plus you got the WARarm of hell on your ass, snare you, CS you and tourbilol...
Frankly, WARDUID was/ still? a damn compo//
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  Sat 10 Apr 2010 - 13:21  #
noup.

i dont use SF to keep druid in combat. has better uses.
the other dps, even a warrior, wont kill my melee.
and dispelling goes at the same time while i heal, pretty much. as disc, my melee gets way less dmg.
and i am not talking theory. its simply i barely lose against warr/druid. the only times we lost it was due to some blunder from our side.
the druid WILL be OOM. very fast. and dispell needs so little mana compared to the result, its almost hilarious.
dispelling > HOT. removing 2 HOT or 2 stacks < less mana cost than casting 2. i come out way up in the mana matchup.

I find druid warr matchups to be rather quick fights, simply because of how quick the druid will be oom.

the ONLY way they will EVER win, is when the druid is smart enough to CC my melee while his warr goes on me and for some reason i can't lose him. happens a few times. but very few.

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  Sun 11 Apr 2010 - 6:41  #
Hey guys, got dumped yesterday. What an amazing week.
Urubaen 
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  Sun 11 Apr 2010 - 6:46  #
Hirna_zjmj wrote:
Hey guys, got dumped yesterday. What an amazing week.

No No ah man times suck for you but here's a quote for you:

Don't dwell on what went wrong. Instead, focus on what to do next. Spend your energies on moving forward toward finding the answer.

Denis Waitley

Good luck and dont forget the cheery banana ->
Hirna_zjmj 
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  Sun 11 Apr 2010 - 10:10  #
Yeah actually it's not like dump it's more like : we're not gonna be together in one month or so, let's break up so it's not gonna be hard when the time to leave china will come. But we stay friends, and very close.
Anyways, I enjoyed the rest of the night with a friend.
We went to many clubs working as "wingmen" Very Happy

And the "have you met Ted ?" technique actually works!

Anyways cheers, always look on the bright side of life. I don't know where I'll be next year but there will be other girls too.
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  Sun 11 Apr 2010 - 13:34  #
By the way any note fact when cat come hunters will no longer use mana, They will be using ap like thr rouge. So alot dex will come to play.

I think it depends on weapon your using. Gun hunter i say orc and turen.Bow i say Bl. Troll does its crossbow. I like bl better has better dex than rest and moves quicker
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  Sun 11 Apr 2010 - 15:20  #
bcastleberg wrote:
By the way any note fact when cat come hunters will no longer use mana, They will be using ap like thr rouge. So alot dex will come to play.

I think it depends on weapon your using. Gun hunter i say orc and turen.Bow i say Bl. Troll does its crossbow. I like bl better has better dex than rest and moves quicker

no race has more dexterity or moves quicker. It's just the size of the character that gives the impression you're moving faster or slower.
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  Mon 12 Apr 2010 - 3:03  #
bcastleberg wrote:
By the way any note fact when cat come hunters will no longer use mana, They will be using ap like thr rouge. So alot dex will come to play.

I think it depends on weapon your using. Gun hunter i say orc and turen.Bow i say Bl. Troll does its crossbow. I like bl better has better dex than rest and moves quicker

rofl, are we playing the same game man ?

I mean, really ? rendeer
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